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trpgforum
Experienced
Topic Author
Posts: 47
Joined: 05 Jul 2019, 03:40

Problems with title, description and "picture number"

01 Oct 2020, 12:29

Accidentally entered the title in the Description field in the Gallery tab. I noticed this later, cut out the entire content of the Description field and copied it into the Title field. That looks good so far. After saving and refreshing the page, the text in the Description field is there again! Deleting does not work either. Only if I put exactly one single space in Description does the Description disappear from the description in the popup caption. But of course that is not the solution either, since the space now creates an empty line! Switching the setting Save ITPC in JPEG on and off does not help either! I already had the same problem with deleting the title field!

In addition, I urgently need a way to only show the image file name (without extension) which should be used as the order number for my customers as a hover caption above the thumbnails. Unfortunately, all of this is extremely complex; I have probably already spent days with these problems, because not all fields Title, description, foldername (not path, for example "mushrooms"), Filename with Extension and Filename without Extension can be used as simple variables.

Hopefully we will find a clean solution in this area, because as you know I am otherwise a very big fan of the fantastic Photogallery X3!

Thank you so much and best regards from Basel
Thomas
THOMAS RUF PHOTOGRAPHY
Landscape - Nature - Macro
4132 Muttenz
Switzerland
www.thomas-ruf.ch
 
User avatar
mjau-mjau
X3 Wizard
Posts: 12353
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 03:37

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

01 Oct 2020, 23:06

trpgforum wrote:Accidentally entered the title in the Description field in the Gallery tab. I noticed this later, cut out the entire content of the Description field and copied it into the Title field. That looks good so far. After saving and refreshing the page, the text in the Description field is there again! Deleting does not work either. Only if I put exactly one single space in Description does the Description disappear from the description in the popup caption. But of course that is not the solution either, since the space now creates an empty line! Switching the setting Save ITPC in JPEG on and off does not help either! I already had the same problem with deleting the title field!
Does this happen to all images? You create a title or description, and then you can't empty it? I tried from here, and I cannot reproduce this issue. Do you have panel login for me to diagnose this? Or could you at least send the affected photo? Disabling "save iptc" will not remove any existing IPTC data in images or disable IPTC from displaying.
trpgforum wrote:In addition, I urgently need a way to only show the image file name (without extension) which should be used as the order number for my customers as a hover caption above the thumbnails. Unfortunately, all of this is extremely complex; I have probably already spent days with these problems, because not all fields Title, description, foldername (not path, for example "mushrooms"), Filename with Extension and Filename without Extension can be used as simple variables.
The question is a bit unclear. By default, X3 will already display caption as filename without extension (as long as title is not set). See demo below, on hover the filename without extension displays (+ description, but that can be disabled obviously):
https://demo.photo.gallery/examples/gallery/grid/

Furthermore, there are already variables that can be used in captions (title or description). You can use var {file_name} in captions to dynamically display the file name without extension. If you populate this page settings > gallery > captions > caption defaults, you can have it apply for all images in a folder.
 
trpgforum
Experienced
Topic Author
Posts: 47
Joined: 05 Jul 2019, 03:40

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

10 Nov 2020, 09:16

Hello Karl

Please excuse my delay in responding! I wanted to try one last time to find a solution for the picture numbering described. And although I also work as an engineer in software development, I again failed ;-). I also think my requirements are not extreme and probably meet the standards of professional photo galleries.

My goal was this:

A) In the gallery view with the thumbnails, I only want to display the image number (file name without extension, e.g. 2020-17-15_044) for quick and easy ordering and communication with customers. It would be nice, as has already been resolved, to choose whether as overlay caption, inline caption or as tooltip caption

B) In the Popup view I would like to display the image number (always), the picture title (if available, otherwise empty) and the description (if available, otherwise empty) one below the other.

C) For SEO, all available information from B) should be written as image title, image description, alt tag, etc. in all images (thumbnails and popups).

In my opinion, the main problem is that if there is a title, the file name will not be displayed! I think, a possibly existing title must never replace the image number! This eliminates the simplest solution of simply being able to control for each view which of the information, image number, image title, description you want to display! So it would be easy, e.g. in the inline caption only the image number (file name without extension), in the popup view, however, the image number, title, description (possibly also the date of recording) are displayed correctly. And for SEO to write all complete information in all images in the page such as alt-text, title, description, etc.

It would also be nice to have this information available in the form of variables. For example I didn't find the variable name for image title?

Well, as you know, I'm still a huge fan of Photogallery X3! But JAlbum misses the very simple picture numbering ;-) I hope you apologize for this remark. But even the best product can be improved :-)

Thank you and nice autumn days!

Best regards from sunny Basel
Thomas
THOMAS RUF PHOTOGRAPHY
Landscape - Nature - Macro
4132 Muttenz
Switzerland
www.thomas-ruf.ch
 
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mjau-mjau
X3 Wizard
Posts: 12353
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 03:37

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

11 Nov 2020, 01:19

I think the main issue is that you are looking for a feature "picture numbering", but that logic does not exist in X3. You have your filenames stored as the picture ID + jpg, and that could be used, but only instead of title or description ... You wouldn't be able to use this mechanism AND title AND description.

The logic is that a title can be assembled by the filename, which for many is required, because they don't have any title, and/or don't want to write a unique title and/or the image name is already the title. If the filename is indeed a title, it will be the fallback-title when title is not explicitly assigned. This is practical. In addition, from POPUP settings, you can also assign the FILENAME (including extension) to display. I don't see why many would need to display the filename in addition to title, but there is the option.

In your case however, you are looking for some "image number" feature, which from X3's perspective (or any other app's perspective), is simply your filename. In a gallery layout, it's not normal to need to display the filename ... except when the filename is the title, in which case X3 will create the title from the filename. But it can't show both title AND "filename without extension". For this to work as you explain, it would have to be a new feature.

As mentioned, your options are to use {file_name} variable in either default title or description. If you are also using titles and descriptions, you would need to set to "prepend" or "append", so that the file name gets prepended or appended to the actual title or description. This is probably the solution you are looking for to be honst.
Image
trpgforum wrote:C) For SEO, all available information from B) should be written as image title, image description, alt tag, etc. in all images (thumbnails and popups).
I'm not quite sure what you are asking for here ... Search engines should and will see/read the exact same as humans. The only non-visible seo-related field, is the ALT tag, which will get populated by the image TITLE (if set). I also don't see the point of "stuffing" filename into the alt tag when it's already the file name.
 
trpgforum
Experienced
Topic Author
Posts: 47
Joined: 05 Jul 2019, 03:40

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

11 Nov 2020, 03:41

Hello Karl

Thanks for your quick reply! 
Unfortunately, I was unable to explain the small but extremely annoying problem with my English. Allow me to try again:

A. clarification
Of course, the file name without an extension is sufficient for me as a picture number, as it is represented by the variable {file_name}.

B. Basis
Many professional photographers always name the file names of ALL images on the website according to the image number. For example 2020_12_05_001.jpg, which corresponds to the picture number 2020_12_05_001.

This image number 2020_12_05_001 should now be displayed in the gallery view (page with the many preview images) as inline caption or overlay caption or tooltip caption as desired. This is what customers need to see in order to write down a selection and e.g. to order by email. And there is enough space for this number even with thumbnails.

In the professional field, additional information about the image is almost always contained in the image title (e.g. "Matterhorn") and the image description (e.g. "Captured from Zermatt at early morning"). Of course, this can sometimes be empty and sometimes filled. These details only become interesting when a gallery visitor has opened the Popup.

C. Task
I would like the following professional picture labeling solution:

C1. In thumbnails, ONLY the image number {file_name} should be displayed as inline caption or overlay caption or tooltip caption (depending on the option selected)

C2. All available information should be displayed in the Popup view as desired in Options:
• {file-name}
Image title (if available)
Image description (if available)

D. Implementation / problem
With your suggestion {file_name} in the default image title, you can actually display the image number (=file_name) on the gallery page as s desired under C1. But now comes the problem: In this case you have to do without the important display of the image title in the Popup view! 

You can play around however you want, you will never make this simple task! You cannot use the APPEND and PREPEND options in the default Image title because C1 is then no longer OK: The thumbnails will then show {file_name} AND the image title, which is way too long. And if the image title is missing, the «file name » appears again instead of the image title

And what else I have tried, I prefer to leave out, otherwise this post will be many pages longer ;-)

E. Solutions
In my opinion, only new variables analogous to {file_name} for the image title (e.g. {image_title} and image description (e.g. {image_description}) can solve the problem sustainably. This is also perfectly solved in JALBUM, which I used before Photo Gallery X3.

F. SEO
I agree with your comments. I admit I didn't look too closely either. I just wanted to point out that all available information about the image should be correctly written into the source code of the page for SEO purposes if possible. All the better when that is already fulfilled!

G. Final remarks
As a big fan of Photo Gallery X3, I have already been able to convince customers to license this great solution as well. Like me, these customers are enthusiastic about the quality of the design, the speed and elegance of this solution. This is another reason why I am convinced that the above labeling must be possible.

Thank you very much for your great support!

Best regards
Thomas



 
THOMAS RUF PHOTOGRAPHY
Landscape - Nature - Macro
4132 Muttenz
Switzerland
www.thomas-ruf.ch
 
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mjau-mjau
X3 Wizard
Posts: 12353
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 03:37

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

11 Nov 2020, 05:45

Ok, I will look into it. I imagine the best solution is simply to add new items [file_name] and [file_name_ext] for gallery captions (inline, overlay and tooltip), as well as new option [file_name] (without extension) for POPUP (file name WITH extension already exists).
trpgforum wrote: In my opinion, only new variables analogous to {file_name} for the image title (e.g. {image_title} and image description (e.g. {image_description}) can solve the problem sustainably. This is also perfectly solved in JALBUM, which I used before Photo Gallery X3.
I can't quite see the need of additional variables. The point of {file_name} (and other existing vars) is to be able to include fixed file data in your titles and descriptions. I don't see how {image_title} and {image_description} can be used in any useful way, used within themselves.
 
trpgforum
Experienced
Topic Author
Posts: 47
Joined: 05 Jul 2019, 03:40

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

11 Nov 2020, 08:42

Hello Karl

Thank you so much! Your approach sounds very good and is exactly what we need!

But be careful! The automatism of using the file name without extension when the image title is empty must still be deactivated! This main problem would still lead to major problems with your proposed solution: In the Popup view, e.g. for pictures with an empty image title, the image number (=filename without extension) would displayed twice! In this case the lower field image title must remain empty!

If everything went that way, the variables would actually be secondary. But it would still make sense: Together with the other options, they result in extensive freedom. For example you can combine the image title and the image description as text and format them exactly as the design requires: 

<b>{image_title}</b> | >{image_description}

Matterhorn | This unusual picture was taken at minus 25 degrees on the Gornergrat

Now I hope that the important image number problem will be solved as soon as possible!

Thanks and best regards
Thomas
THOMAS RUF PHOTOGRAPHY
Landscape - Nature - Macro
4132 Muttenz
Switzerland
www.thomas-ruf.ch
 
User avatar
mjau-mjau
X3 Wizard
Posts: 12353
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 03:37

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

11 Nov 2020, 22:05

trpgforum wrote:But be careful! The automatism of using the file name without extension when the image title is empty must still be deactivated! This main problem would still lead to major problems with your proposed solution: In the Popup view, e.g. for pictures with an empty image title, the image number (=filename without extension) would displayed twice! In this case the lower field image title must remain empty!
I don't quite see what you are proposing. If you select FIXED options like [file_name] and [file_name_ext], they always exist, and will therefore always display when selected, regardless of other options. In your case, you would instead un-check "Create title from filename if empty title", which means the title would only display if a unique title exists, and there would be no duplicate filename.
Image
trpgforum wrote:If everything went that way, the variables would actually be secondary. But it would still make sense: Together with the other options, they result in extensive freedom. For example you can combine the image title and the image description as text and format them exactly as the design requires: 

<b>{image_title}</b> | >{image_description}

Matterhorn | This unusual picture was taken at minus 25 degrees on the Gornergrat
I believe you are thinking of some kind of caption-template, which is actually a really good idea. It doesn't fit into the current implementation, but I will definitely note it down as an idea for a future release.

The only challenge is what do do when items like {image_description} and {image_title} are empty (like in your case)? When formatting with html (<br><strong>|.) you will end up with orphan tags/text, empty lines and empty spaces.
trpgforum wrote:Now I hope that the important image number problem will be solved as soon as possible!
I will try to squeeze it into new pending X3 release (a few weeks away).
 
trpgforum
Experienced
Topic Author
Posts: 47
Joined: 05 Jul 2019, 03:40

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

12 Nov 2020, 01:49

Hello Karl

Thank you so much! So as you describe it, of course everything is OK!
This is exactly what I need so badly!

I wish you every success with the implementation!
Best regards
Thomas
THOMAS RUF PHOTOGRAPHY
Landscape - Nature - Macro
4132 Muttenz
Switzerland
www.thomas-ruf.ch
 
User avatar
mjau-mjau
X3 Wizard
Posts: 12353
Joined: 30 Sep 2006, 03:37

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

12 Nov 2020, 21:54

The only thing I am not sure about, is what variations of filename to include as options
  • filename_ext
    [2020_12_05_001.jpg]
    This is simply the file name with extension.
  • filename
    [2020_12_05_001]
    File name without extension.
  • filename_nice
    [2020 12 05 001]
    File name without extension and -hypens and _underscores replaced by empty space. This is often a more human-friendly version of the above, and how we create titles from file names.
I'm still very keen to limit the amount of "clutter" in X3 options.
 
trpgforum
Experienced
Topic Author
Posts: 47
Joined: 05 Jul 2019, 03:40

Re: Problems with title, description and "picture number"

13 Nov 2020, 01:35

Hello Karl

Thank you very much!

I think, filename_ext and filname are important. 
In my opinion, filename_nice is nice, but not absolutely necessary!

Wish you a beautiful weekend!

Thomas
THOMAS RUF PHOTOGRAPHY
Landscape - Nature - Macro
4132 Muttenz
Switzerland
www.thomas-ruf.ch